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Yep 2: [Sticky, Closed] Ironic Apps, Spotlight, and Yep 2

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      CommentAuthorBLUEFROG
    • CommentTimeNov 12th 2009 edited
     
    Some questions to consider about performance in Ironic apps… (with an emphasis on Yep 2 and the "missing files" question)

    1. Have you previously used Yep 1.x? If you choose to convert your Yep 1 Tags to OMTags (which we advocate you do and there is no ill effect to Yep 1's original Tags) , Spotlight will have to index those changes. See "On Spotlight".

    2. Have you already tagged files with OpenMeta Tags with another application (Tags, Leap, Fresh, etc.)? (If the preference is set to Add tagged files from anywhere then Yep should mark these as Managed.

    3. When you first launched Yep, did you choose to "Auto Import" or change the settings yourself? (This is a bit of information gathering as to how many Users are using what option.)

    4. Are you using FileVault? There are known issues with Spotlight and FileVault.

    5. Are you storing files on disk images or networked volumes? Disk images are not indexed by Spotlight by default though indexing can be turned on and be quite successful.
    However, Spotlight's indexing is limited on network volumes. (Since there is a wide variety of configurations possible with networked drives, testing in your environment is imperative. If a networked drive is properly indexed then you should be able to do a successful content search - filenames are usually indexed by default so that is a poor measure of a valid index.) Also, there is a possibility that some networked volumes can only be indexed with OS X Server. Please check with Apple Support for more info on the subject.

    6. Do you have any locations added to the System Preferences > Spotlight > Privacy pane? If Spotlight can't see it, neither can Yep 2.

    7. Are you using any third party applications to disable or inhibit Spotlight functionality? Once again, if you turn off Spotlight, you're turning off functionality in our applications.

    8. Have you rebuilt your Spotlight index? An invalid index infringes on the ability of our apps to perform as coded. (This can be accomplished in the Advanced preferences of Yep 2 or Leap 2.)

    9. Do you have permissions to view the files / folders in question? Our apps honor permissions, so if you don't have permission to be looking at something, you shouldn't see it in our apps.

    10. Are you using a Standard or Administrative account? (Again, just gathering info to try and eliminate possible issues.)

    11. Does this behavior persist after rebooting your machine? Many times, for many applications, rebooting helps cure problems.

    12. Are you using DropBox (or other cloud computing service to sync files, iDisk included)? These services do not support preserving extended attributes (including OpenMeta Tags).
    ** This is a known issue and has been discussed on these Forums. DropBox is the only service we are aware of that is endeavoring to fix this issue. You can vote for extended attribute support on their VoteBox.

    13. Are you using any local backup applications that are not metadata aware? Not all backup programs preserve metadata and/or extended attributes. Be sure to check with the vendor of your backup software for more information if you are unsure of this.

    • Try dropping a file on the DropZone at the edge of your screen. We have had some reports that this has "restarted" Spotlight but need more information to validate the results.

    • Make sure you are running at least Yep 2.0.9.
    …
    •  
      CommentAuthorBLUEFROG
    • CommentTimeNov 12th 2009
     
    On Spotlight:
    Spotlight can take a considerable amount of time depending on how many files and Tags it's indexing changes for. The initial launch of Yep 2 will be slower to show files because of the sudden flood of metadata (which we have throttled back to lessen the burden on Spotlight) but should be much faster afterwards. Do note that if you decide to Tag 2500 files at once, you may see another temporary slowdown while Spotlight works. Remember, in the normal course of things, Spotlight can easily keep up with indexing changes. It is a more unusual condition to have such a deluge of filesystem changes at once so Spotlight can slow down.

    On Yep 2:
    Yep 2 only deals with Managed files. I can't emphasize this enough.

    When you start Yep 2 for the first time, there are no Managed files on your computer. Yep then sets about marking files as Managed depending on your preferences. When it marks a file as Managed it is writing metadata to the file. These changes get noticed by Spotlight and it's index gets updated to reflect the new metadata. If there are a large number of changes to be indexed (and there most likely will be), Spotlight can slow down it's indexing. Yep can only see files that have been indexed so it will not show those files until Spotlight gets to them.

    As far as Spotlight being able to see files… Spotlight can see files that it has indexed information for. But if Spotlight hasn't indexed the addition of the Managed attribute on a file, it won't find that file just as Yep won't be able to see it.

    On Yep 1:
    Yep 1.x used a proprietary, closed database system that tracked files and metadata in a very different way. Though it worked well enough, it was inaccessible to the rest of the computer (other apps, the OS, etc.). Also, the burden of maintaining the ever increasing database was on Yep's shoulders. Meanwhile, Spotlight has been maintaining it's own indices and tracking changes and, quite honestly, it's pretty good at it. So with the advent of OpenMeta the choice became more clear… let Spotlight do the heavy lifting for tracking metadata and we'll just ask it for info when we need it. No more closed databases, Yep Tags are visible in other apps that use Spotlight technology, no worries about Tags being incorrectly synced, no secondary files to back up (disregarding .omback files which are for another purpose), etc.

    I hope this helps clear up some questions people may have. We are still looking at potential issues and ways to fine-tune performance.

    Jim
    The Ironic Software Team
    •  
      CommentAuthorBLUEFROG
    • CommentTimeNov 13th 2009 edited
     
    If you would like to answer these questions please do so on this discussion: RE: Ironic Apps, Spotlight, and Yep 2 or email your answers to Ironic Support. Thanks.

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